Version 3 - Suggestions

For all support and comments on the game "GrassGames' Hearts".
steveamida
Posts: 10
Joined: Nov 02, 2019

Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by steveamida »

A tournament is simply a supplemental addition to the normal open game play structure. If you choose to be involved in a tourney, you know what the structure is, and decide to enter or not. It's purpose is to add a degree of enjoyment to those who so choose.

I also am opposed to automatically removing those in the lobby who choose to be there while awaiting a game of their choice. It is not like being there is keeping anyone else from entering the lobby or being in a game of their choice. Call me pro choice lol.

Butchdude
Posts: 36
Joined: Sep 21, 2016

Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by Butchdude »

By the time a player reads through Aidan's menu of chat topics and decides which is the most appropriate for the occasion, the player will be timed out. The concept is ridiculous.

HowCoolIsThat
Posts: 41
Joined: Feb 18, 2018

Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by HowCoolIsThat »

What Howie (Butchdude) said X 1,000,000. Game times would be several hours...HowAbusiveIsThat? :lol:

SunnyCorner
Posts: 174
Joined: Nov 17, 2013

Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by SunnyCorner »

All attempts to stop the abuse are very welcome Aidan, if players want to chat they should go to a chat room where Inane drivel can be exchanged freely.

Regards Ice

steveamida
Posts: 10
Joined: Nov 02, 2019

Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by steveamida »

The chat solution is simple me thinks. Have a button that any player can use to turn off chat. They then see no chat, nor can chat themselves. If 2 players push the button, no further chat is allowed. A "No chat" button would light up under their name, and anyone else would know they are not seeing chat, so little point in abuse.Or some such. The menu idea is just not practical.

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Aidan
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Joined: Jan 17, 2009

Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by Aidan »

By the time a player reads through Aidan's menu of chat topics and decides which is the most appropriate for the occasion, the player will be timed out.
I don't agree with this. The menu items are all grouped for easy access (e.g. connection -> invite -> "invite me please"), and the more you use it the easier and faster it will get.
The concept is ridiculous.
This is not my concept by the way, it is used in other games also.
Have a button that any player can use to turn off chat. They then see no chat, nor can chat themselves. If 2 players push the button, no further chat is allowed.
This is another option, but I'm not sure if it will work out. If people turn off the chat totally which will happen then that removes all the good things that any chat brings. It also does not solve the abuse problem really as people can keep hurling abusing at each other without disabling the chat. But it is an easier option to implement.

But I think the menu option has to be used anyway as I plan to get the game out onto consoles in the future and they don't have keyboards at all or touch screens. Trying to type out a message by selecting letters using a game controller will not work out. In fact I think that factor will probably decided the outcome of this discussion.
Aidan
GrassGames.com

steveamida
Posts: 10
Joined: Nov 02, 2019

Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by steveamida »

With all due respect, I am not convinced you could not do both. In order to not lose the very important, and perhaps underestimated value of the social aspects of the game, you could program the following: Open chat is allowed as well as the 'menu system' for chat, unless someone (or 2?) select the "NO CHAT" button. At which time the 'menu system' of chat is all that is available. That way all the goals are addressed...yours to have it work for consoles etc, those who want open chat have it, but know they can be cut off if they are abusive, and the menu option is available in the situation where open chat is cut off. More complicated I understand, however if the goal is get more folks on the site, the silencing of the abusers, the freedom to play or not, and the SOCIAL aspect of the game, all need to be preserved.

cenalex67
Posts: 25
Joined: Jan 02, 2016

Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by cenalex67 »

Hi Aidan
Chat Yes or chat NO...
How many problems!
Can the host decide whether to enable or disable the chat in his rules of the game?
When he invites me i can decide if join or not.
Can it be an idea?
Alex

HowCoolIsThat
Posts: 41
Joined: Feb 18, 2018

Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by HowCoolIsThat »

Here's a suggestion: can you link all of the players in the game to the server in such a way that it's not dependent on the host to keep everyone connected. When a player who is not the host gets disconnected (or quits), a bot comes in. However, when the host gets disconnected (or quits), the game is nullified without any penalty to the host.

Also, if you choose to kill the free chat feature, you're weakening the platform. Just sayin'

SunnyCorner
Posts: 174
Joined: Nov 17, 2013

Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by SunnyCorner »

As requested - some suggestions for the chat lexicon.......

Why have you led clubs when low has just passed on them? (Usually on the 2nd hand of the game)

Why do you keep leading spades to low?

Why don't you cover your passes?

Why do you keep ducking?

Why didn't you stop that moon?

Why did you stop that moon?

Why do you keep dumping (especially on high)?

Why did you do that – its pushed him/her over 100 and ended the game?

You appear to be a serial quitter

Regards Ice

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Aidan
Posts: 708
Joined: Jan 17, 2009

Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by Aidan »

Here's a suggestion: can you link all of the players in the game to the server in such a way that it's not dependent on the host to keep everyone connected. When a player who is not the host gets disconnected (or quits), a bot comes in. However, when the host gets disconnected (or quits), the game is nullified without any penalty to the host.
The bot is supposed to take over when the host quits also, although its a complicated procedure. Sounds like its not working. I'll have another look.
Aidan
GrassGames.com

SunnyCorner
Posts: 174
Joined: Nov 17, 2013

Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by SunnyCorner »

Ah yes - thanks for reminding me of another suggestion for the lexicon,

"These 2 players are known to each other they have the same IP" (only legitimate when the players in question have failed to notify the others)

Regards ice

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Aidan
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Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by Aidan »

I've noticed now that I show the current hand scores during play. I'm surprised I implemented this, as part of the skill of the game is to remember who has taken points and who has not, and this takes that skill aspect away. Maybe an option for this is needed? Or not?
Aidan
GrassGames.com

SunnyCorner
Posts: 174
Joined: Nov 17, 2013

Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by SunnyCorner »

I agree - it lowers the skill content.

Regards Ice

steveamida
Posts: 10
Joined: Nov 02, 2019

Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by steveamida »

I disagree. If the objective is to increase the usage of the game and the number of users, by making the game more difficult for the average user the objective will not be reached. Thus the old saw, "Watch what you ask for, you may get it". There are precious few users now; making the game more difficult will drive yet more away. Thanks for your consideration.

cenalex67
Posts: 25
Joined: Jan 02, 2016

Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by cenalex67 »

Aidan wrote:
Apr 26, 2021
I've noticed now that I show the current hand scores during play. I'm surprised I implemented this, as part of the skill of the game is to remember who has taken points and who has not, and this takes that skill aspect away. Maybe an option for this is needed? Or not?
Hi Aidan
I think this could be a good idea.
Can the player enable or disable it?
Another good idea, to improve personal experience, could be to show a little icon that remembers the last pass. For example: Left arrow, right arrow, up arrow or X.
Thx
Alex

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Aidan
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Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by Aidan »

could be to show a little icon that remembers the last pass
I was going to implement some pass direction arrow anyways so I'll probably extend this to either leave the pass direction arrow displayed or add some way that it can be shown again if desired.
Aidan
GrassGames.com

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Aidan
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Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by Aidan »

making the game more difficult for the average user
The idea is to make it a bit more like real life play, not more difficult. Skill should always be rewarded whenever possible.
making the game more difficult will drive yet more away
I don't think so. I think the main problem is the abuse and the rankings which I'm making a priority in this release to resolve.
Aidan
GrassGames.com

SunnyCorner
Posts: 174
Joined: Nov 17, 2013

Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by SunnyCorner »

I don't think its necessary to have little arrows indication the last pass direction! Remembering who you passed to, and what you passed, are very basic aspects of the game.

I also think its essential that all players can see the same information on screen as each other - especially whats being posted in chat. It can't be right that players can turn off/on different features when it suits them - particularly during the game - thats just not realistic.

It also might be prudent to remove most/all aspects from the current rules - with the exception of Old Moon or Ask. I've not seen them ever played intentionally. That could then be set to "Standard" which would be less confusing.

I don't particularly have a problem with displaying Old Moon or Ask for those who seem to have short-term memory issues but as the whole game is based on developing memory skills, all attempts to dumb-down should be rejected.

Regards. Ice

HowCoolIsThat
Posts: 41
Joined: Feb 18, 2018

Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by HowCoolIsThat »

This thread has devolved into complete and useless banter where, at the core, is nothing more than censorship to ostensibly thwart abusive dialog. It won't drive sales. It won't bring more players.

Aidan, you should be spending more time trying to market your application in a buy one get two free offering rather than designing "enhancements" which won't significantly impact the overall demand for your app. Ask yourself this Aidan, why haven't your sales increased? It isn't because of the free chat and abuse, it's because no one plays Battleship any more and Hearts 3 ain't never gonna be Call of Duty, Angry Birds or Fortnite. In my honest opinion, you're wasting your time doing anything to change what is an old-school card game app. I'm just trying to be forthright so you can better utilize your time. But hey, my two cents isn't worth much to some people.

SunnyCorner
Posts: 174
Joined: Nov 17, 2013

Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by SunnyCorner »

The game is good Aidan. Its the best version around and its part of a very entertaining platform. I congratulate you on it and I thank you for taking the time to consult with users about potential changes to the format.

There have been many players of the game over the years who have left because of the abuse and many new players leave because they can't get a game or climb to the top because of the weighted scoring system.The changes you propose address both of those issues and should be applauded and supported.

Regards. Ice

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Aidan
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Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by Aidan »

All points of view are valid. However HowCoolIsThat and others, the chat menu option is going to be in V3, but also the free chat option will be available so you should be able to still chat freely with those who want to chat freely. You will also be able to ask people to turn on the free chat from the chat menu so don't panic too much about it - it may not be an issue at all, or just occasionally. How things work out in the end we will just have to see.

I agree with Ice's last point that the game should be the same for all players, that's why I'm against individual players being able to hide the chat as I think it will create inconsistency. The pass arrows / hands history / current hand score I will have to look into more. Maybe if a player enables some of these they could lose a point at the end of the game? Or have a learning number of games for beginners to be allowed to enable these features and then they get some rankings point reduction after the learning period expires? Just thoughts for now.
Aidan
GrassGames.com

HowCoolIsThat
Posts: 41
Joined: Feb 18, 2018

Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by HowCoolIsThat »

Speaking of issues, never mind. I applaud your efforts for any improvements (maybe). Can you possibly build-in an "eject button"?

May the Schwarz be with you.
-- Mel Brooks

ChiGuy
Posts: 9
Joined: Feb 15, 2020

Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by ChiGuy »

I hope the chat feature will continue. I love being able to visit ( in between play ) with those I am playing with. It makes it human, fun and more of a feel like playing cards with a group of friends. I know it makes some ticked off , so being to shut it off is a good idea. However it should not preclude those who wish to visit. I have made many friends playing this game. I hope it continues. Cheers. Scott

nealb2
Posts: 1
Joined: Jun 05, 2021

Re: Version 3 - Suggestions

Post by nealb2 »

If all the tricks will be taken lay the cards down regardless if the queen has not been played. Stop the stupid delay just prior to the playing of the queen of spades.

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